Instead, we need to think about conversations as a climbing wall to do a variant of what my dad did during this trip, pocketing a little nugget of information here, adapting his approach there.

相反，我们需要将对话视为攀岩墙， 以做我父亲在这次旅行中所做的变体， 在这里收集一点信息， 在那里调整他的方法。